MSNBC Hardball Special Edition - Transcript

MSNBC Hardball - Transcript
Monday, May 23, 2005

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MATTHEWS: Thank you very much, David Shuster, for that explanation.

Senator Susan Collins, a Republican from Maine, she helped broker this historic deal tonight.

Senator Collins, thank you very much.

We just talked about what the two party bases are up to. Are you feeling the heat for being one of the deal-makers?

SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R), MAINE: Well, I am feeling very happy tonight that 14 of us were able to come together and forge what I think is a very fair and reasonable compromise that avoids some real crisis for the Senate as an institution.

It's also going to allow us to now confirm some judges who've been held up in the past and also to move on with the work of the people of this nation.

MATTHEWS: Well, you're going to hear from two different groups, it seems to me, Senator. You're going to be hearing from the conservative Christian groups. You're going to be hearing from the pro-choice militants. Don't they want a clear-cut victory here for either side?

COLLINS: You know, the clear-cut victory tonight was for the American people and for preserving the traditions of the Senate. I think there are not losers tonight. I think that there are only winners.

I realize some people on the extreme left and the extreme right are unhappy that this crisis has been averted, but I think we acted in the best interests of the country.

MATTHEWS: Do you think that the leadership, under Bill Frist, Senator Frist from Tennessee, and the president, are going to go out and punish people like you for probably, from their point of view, stealing defeat from the jaws of victory?

COLLINS: Well, but...

MATTHEWS: Because they had the numbers, didn't they? Didn't they have the votes they needed to kill the filibuster in judicial nominations going into tomorrow?

COLLINS: It's hard to predict how the vote would have come out.

From what the leaders on both sides said and given the intense lobbying, I think it was too close to call. There were several of us who had not announced our position. We wanted a compromise. And we achieved one. I think that the president and Senator Frist can be very happy about this agreement, because it sets as the general rule that there will not be filibusters of judicial nominees.

The only case in which a filibuster could occur is if there were extraordinary circumstances. I think that's a high threshold. So, in the end, I think the president and the majority leader are getting what they sought in the vast majority of cases. And that is a straight up-and-down vote.

MATTHEWS: Thank you very much. It's great having you on, Senator Susan Collins of Maine.

COLLINS: Thank you.

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