CNN "Erin Burnett Outfront" - Transcript: Iraq

Interview

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BURNETT: Joe Johns, thank you. Joining me now Democratic Senator Jack Reed. He graduated from West Point, served in the Army for over a decade and now serves on the Senate Armed Services Committee. He was one of the very few who voted against the Iraq war.

Senator, good to have you with us tonight. You voted against this war. What does the U.S. do now?

SEN. JACK REED (D-RI), ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE: Well, first, I think the key issue is what Maliki does. Maliki has managed to militarize the politics and politicize the military. Unless he changes course dramatically, then there's serious danger ahead, even more serious danger ahead for Iraq. But the key is what the Iraqis do and the key right now is in his hands.

BURNETT: You know, you just heard a moment ago, Senator, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Martin Dempsey saying and I'll quote him, "It's in our national interests to counter ISIS wherever we find them. There's execution video coming out of Iraq this week, members of ISIS executing Iraqis in cold blood. You voted against this war, but can this be stopped without American intervention?

REED: Well, it has to be stopped, but the key, again, I think is fundamental, it has to be stopped by the Iraqis. The ISIS forces, ISIS forces that attacked Mosul were several thousand perhaps against 15,000 equipped and trained Iraqi national security forces with armor, with artillery, and they just disintegrated. So an American involvement without real engagement on the ground by Iraqi forces and real political leadership will not be decisive.

We have an interest in protecting the United States. So if we can identify ISIS leaders, if we can go after them not on behalf of the Iraqis, but on our own self-interests and take them out, that's a different story. But simply -- I think David Petraeus said very well today in London, we can't be the air force for Maliki's Iraq.

BURNETT: Before your vote against the Iraq war to begin with, the "Boston Globe" quoted you as saying pre-emption is the only viable strategy against terrorism. If ISIS is a terrorist group and you believe in pre-emption, how do you pre-empt ISIS now from possible attacks on America? They've obviously gained control of cities, towns, possibly a country.

REED: Well, the same technique that we've used in places like Yemen, in other places around the world where we're not committing ground forces and we're not trying to be a surrogate for the local government. We've identified individuals with good intelligence that pose an intimate threat to the United States and we use every resource possible.

BURNETT: You're talking about drone strikes and things like that.

REED: Well, drone strikes, yes. Just within hours ago, we seized the purported ring leader of the attack on our Benghazi, Libya. We did that because that is a terror group and obviously they conduct an operation against us. So we have to be very careful. Pre-emption is the way to go with respect to terrorist group, but pre-emption in support of a government that's chosen or proven itself to be not inclusive. Not effective, that's not the right strategy.

BURNETT: Before we go, you've been to Iraq multiple times. You traveled with then-candidate Barack Obama and Chuck Hagel. You said that Saddam is a secular thug not a messianic leader. When you look back, would Iraq be in a better place right now if U.S. hadn't invaded. Yes, Saddam was a bad guy, but the Middle East was in balance.

REED: It would be a very different place. It's very hard to what if, et cetera. But clear that the invasion of Iraq triggered repercussion, some predictable, some unpredictable. But the notion that it would cause turmoil and generate this sectarian rivalry is something that became evident very quickly. In the chaos in the wake of our invasion, sectarian groups rose up.

And this would be different now, again, it's hard to replay history, but I know it would be a different situation not to justify anything that Saddam did. He was a secular thug. But there was a balance between the Shia/Sunni communities and that was completely thrown out of balance by our invasion of Iraq.

BURNETT: You know, there's been a lot of criticism over the past few days, criticism of the Bush administration and the president. Former Vice President Dick Cheney, one of the architects of the war wrote an op-ed about President Obama and said rarely has a U.S. president been so wrong about so much at the expense of so many. Your reaction?

REED: He could say much the same thing about himself and President Bush, so wrong about the reaction to Iraq and Saddam in 2003, 2002 based upon the assumption that they were developing or had weapons of mass destruction, which proved to be absolutely inaccurate. So I think ironic enough it's probably a good commentary on his own performance.

BURNETT: Thank you very much, Senator Reed.

REED: Thank you.

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