MSNBC "The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript - Abortion

Interview

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REP. ZOE LOFGREN (D), CALIFORNIA: I just find it astonishing to hear a phrase repeated that the incidence of pregnancy from rape is low. That`s not -- I mean, there`s no scientific basis for that. And the idea that the Republican men on this committee think they can tell the women of America that they have to carry to term the product of a rape is outrageous.

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MADDOW: That was Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren of California reacting shortly after Congressman Trent Franks made his statement about the incidence of rape causing pregnancy.

Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren joins us now.

Congresswoman, thank you very much for being with us. Pleasure to have you here.

LOFGREN: Glad to be here, Rachel.

MADDOW: You said that Congressman Franks` statement was astonishing to you. How did your Republican colleagues on the committee respond when he said what he did?

LOFGREN: Well, they didn`t say very much and I think they quickly realized he had a Todd Akin moment and certainly the chairman shortly thereafter recessed the committee hearing. So I think so they could figure out what to do next. And, of course, as we know, he tried to walk back the statement after the recess. But, I mean, he said what he said and I thought it was an absurd statement and not true but really an indication of a real problem on the other side of the aisle when it comes to respecting women.

MADDOW: Congresswoman Marsha Blackburn is going to be handling this measure tomorrow for the floor vote instead of Congressman Franks. They`ve taken it out of his hands.

Republican aides have told NBC News tonight we should expect a good showing a Republican women on the floor tomorrow arguing for the bill. They say that is by design.

What do you think is going on there with Trent Franks sort of being, having this taken away from him and them branding it the way that they are on the other side?

LOFGREN: Well, there aren`t very many women in the House, just 78 o of the 435. Three-quarters of the women are Democrats and almost all of them are pro-choice. Almost all of the Republican women are anti-choice. So the fact that there is a Republican woman arguing for this bill doesn`t mean that the bill isn`t anti-choice and disrespectful to the rights of American women. Congresswoman Blackburn has a long record of -- she`s a co-sponsor of the bill and, you know, she has the same view as Congressman Franks as to whether this bill should be passed. And we`ll have, I hope, a civilized discussion.

Passage of the bill is wrong. It`s wrong policy for the freedom of American women.

MADDOW: Why do you think that the House is moving forward on this when we have a clear and overt veto promise from the White House today? Nobody has any delusions that this might go anywhere in the Senate. This will never do anything more than pass the House.

Why prioritize this?

LOFGREN: That`s a very good question. I mean, there are a lot of things we need to be doing from top to bottom, immigration reform. Working on our economy so there are more jobs in America and why we would do a detour for this which is not only wrong policy, but never going to become law is a good question.

I know that all around the country, Republicans are trying to pass bills like this one. I can only assume it`s trying to tee up a new case with the Supreme Court in the hopes that the rights of American women can be diminished. I can only gather, or guess, that this is really an attempt to appeal to a narrow base that is against rights for women in America.

MADDOW: On the issue of the rape and incest exemption, that is not -- the was no rape or incest exemption when this went through the committee process. That was change by the Republicans I understand.

LOFGREN: Sort of.

MADDOW: By their own design on Friday, after they resisted that for a long time. That`s what led to Congressman Franks saying what he did about low incidence of rape-caused pregnancy.

Seeing the fight over this, particularly in Wisconsin, where the opponents of the bill there were so eloquent in arguing about why you shouldn`t assume that women are lying about being raped. You shouldn`t make them assume that it`s a lie unless it`s reported to the police. That is the way this exemption is crafted now in the bill that`s going to go to the House floor tomorrow, do you expect that to become an issue?

LOFGREN: Well, I planned to talk about it. I mean, we have every year 25,000 pregnancies in America that are caused by rape, but we only that only about 35 percent of sexual assaults are actually reported to the police. There are a lot of reasons why an assault might not be reported -- everything from fear to if it`s a young person, protecting them, in some cases, shame or anxiety in a community.

And so to say that there`s got to be a report is really to say that women are going to lie about this. That`s absurd. That`s -- I hate to think that that`s really what the Republicans are saying, but that`s the only conclusion that can be reached.

And as for the health exception, there really isn`t a health exception unless you`re going to die. Well, that`s something that is very difficult for a doctor to say with precision and, of course, if doctors guess wrong, they`re facing a five-year sentence in prison. So this is really a very wrongheaded approach putting the Republicans in the House in the place of women and their husbands and their doctors, I just don`t think that America`s clamoring for that.

MADDOW: Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren of California, thank you very much for your time tonight. It`s nice to have you here.

LOFGREN: Thank you.

MADDOW: Thank you.

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