CNN Paula Zahn Now - Transcript

CNN

SHOW: PAULA ZAHN NOW 20:00

HEADLINE: Military Trains Soldiers on Iraqi Culture; Assault Weapon Ban to Expire

GUESTS: John Warner, Bobby Muller, Jack Reed, Joe Repya, Don Davis, William Bratton

BYLINE: Ron Young, Chris Lawrence, Joe Johns, Jim Clancy, Paula Zahn

HIGHLIGHT: New questions are being raised about the military record of George W. Bush. How will the return of the assault weapons debate impact presidential politics?

BODY:
ZAHN: The Iraqi prisoner abuse scandal was the subject of not one, but two hearings today on Capitol Hill. And it appears that the patience of some lawmakers is growing thin.

They expressed frustration that they don't have all the information they need to determine where responsibility lies. Well, now one member of the Senate Armed Services Committee is actually joining a group of retired military officers in publicly calling for an independent investigation.

We turn now to Senator Jack Reed, Democrat of Rhode Island.

Good to see you, sir. Welcome.

SEN. JACK REED (D), RHODE ISLAND: Thank you, Paula.

ZAHN: So already we have seen some 200 investigations, 50 reviews. What makes you think yet another investigation will yield what you really want to know?

REED: Well, all these investigations have revealed some facts, but they haven't got out the full picture of what happened. In fact, every time we get one of these investigations, we discover we have to have another investigation.

General Jones and General Fay reported today to our committee, but they said essentially they can't make any comments really on the ghost detainees because they've had no cooperation from the CIA.

ZAHN: What are you suggesting, Senator, that they're doing this and breaking it into these smaller investigations because it's a presidential year, or are you suggesting there's a cover-up here?

REED: No, I'm suggesting that whatever logic existed initially to look at this in small, little pieces no longer has any compelling logic behind it, actually, that we're not getting to some basic fundamental answers.

ZAHN: Are you saying that this process has gotten so bogged down in bureaucracy because of the weight what was we're talking about here or is someone playing a game?

REED: Well, I think the longer this is played out, the longer it appears to me that this is not inadvertent, that these multiple investigations, limiting them has some purpose. Now, I don't know, because of the sheer multiplicity of the investigations, is it just accidental or is there some type of coordinated effort?

I do know and do believe that we'll not get to the bottom of this unless we have an independent investigation by authorities that are not responsible to the people who are being investigated.

ZAHN: But what would the purpose of that be? Because even you pointed out in your testimony that there are policy issues at a higher level of the Department of Defense that you think need to be addressed here.

REED: Well, that's absolutely the case. And I don't think they're being addressed, because those policy issues are kept off the table.

The focus was initially on five or six renegade soldiers who clearly violated their obligations as soldiers. Then it's migrated up a bit to colonels. Now, based upon today's hearing, it appears that senior officers in Iraq might have been at least nonresponsive to information that they should have responded to. Yet, it hasn't gone up to the level of national policy-making. And I think that level has to be looked at also.

ZAHN: What do you say to critics of this process who are listening to you and the other generals who spoke publicly today and say, wait a minute, this just smacks of politics? Two of these generals have actually called for President Bush's defeat.

REED: This issue is vitally important because it goes to the character and the integrity of our military forces. So I'm not surprised that senior military officers, retired officers, appropriately, should call for an investigation.

ZAHN: And what about the fact that they've publicly called for President Bush's defeat? You can't ignore the politics of it, Senator.

REED: Well, I'm just looking at the facts of the situation as they exist. I think an independent investigation would make good, good sense. And of the two officers that have taken a political position, there are several other officers that have maintained no position politically.

They are soldiers, Marines, and sailors. Some of them themselves were judge advocate generals who have looked at the situation and are shocked not for the political consequences, but I think ultimately to the consequences to our military services.

ZAHN: Senator Jack Reed, thanks you so much for your time tonight. We appreciate it.

REED: Thank you, Paula.