MSNBC "Countdown With Keith Olbermann" - Transcript

Interview

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As promised, time now to call in Senator Ron Wyden, Democrat of Oregon, and member of the Senate Finance Committee.

Good evening, Senator.

WYDEN: Good evening, Keith.

OLBERMANN: Have you decided yet whether you‘ll vote for the health care reform bill?

WYDEN: I haven‘t and it hasn‘t been written. We haven‘t seen it. And I‘ll just tell you, I‘m not going to vote for anything that doesn‘t protect the typical consumer. I want the typical consumer to be able to say to their insurance company, "I‘m giving you an ultimatum. If you don‘t treat me right, I‘m taking my business elsewhere." These bills don‘t do that and they have to.

OLBERMANN: Your colleague, Senator Carper, claimed tonight that conservative Democrats are not likely to support a public option. You don‘t know whether or not you‘ll vote for a bill without a public option, because you don‘t know what the bill looks like. When the majority whip, Mr. Durbin, says, as he did last night, he‘s struggling to find 60 votes. His biggest problem there--is it the conservative members of the caucus or is it the progressive members of the caucus?

WYDEN: I think what Democrats are saying is, we‘ve got to have a bill that works for the typical American, not special interest. That means choice. It means competition.

You look, for example, what the House of Representatives did. They came up with a public option that has 6 million people in it. And they‘re going to be mostly folks who‘ve been sick and haven‘t had coverage.

I look--today, United Healthcare has 70 million subscribers. Now, how in the world are you going to hold the United Health people accountable with 6 million subscribers? United Health is not going exactly be quaking in their boots over that. And I want real choice and real competition because that‘s how you hold the insurance industry accountable.

OLBERMANN: Senator Carper says he doesn‘t even like the opt-out because it would be government-funded. So, he‘s floated yet another compromise that would be a federal entity run by the government that would negotiate rates with providers based on affordability standards in the states. That‘s, I guess, in essence, a trigger option without a delay. What‘s your reaction to this latest of the 3,000 proposals?

WYDEN: What concerns many is you could come up with a very small pool of individuals and, again, not get a good deal for the consumer and not be in a position to take the insurance companies on. I mean, the reason members of Congress do well is we‘re parts of big pools, Keith. We‘ve got low administrative costs. The insurance companies can‘t cherry-pick. They can‘t discriminate against a member of Congress.

So, I‘m not for this opt-out approaches that just reduce the size of the pool because it‘s going to be even harder to get competition and choice.

OLBERMANN: Senator Hatch announced today, as I mentioned, he plans to introduce his own version of that Stupak Amendment from the House, restricting federal funding for abortion, restricting--if it‘s like the Stupak Amendment--restricting a woman‘s right to use their own private insurance to pay for abortions. How might the idea of a Hatch amendment that‘s similar to that or equivalent to that affect your vote?

WYDEN: I certainly won‘t support turning back the clock on women‘s rights. We have had a rough consensus in this country. We are going to protect a women‘s right to choose particularly when there are private dollars involved. There was also a willingness to take the Hyde Amendment, which bans federal funds for abortion. That was a rough consensus.

And, unfortunately, the House is moving away from that. I won‘t support that, because at this time in our history, turning the clock back on women‘s rights would be a huge mistake.

OLBERMANN: Ultimately, Senator, at this point, the way things have gone, and I know this thing has been cyclical and there‘d been ups and downs and highlights and low lights for all these many months, and there will be those to come. But the way this thing is extrapolating out into the future, is it possible that progressives may have to ultimately oppose the bill that is about to be voted on in the Senate when ever that day comes?

WYDEN: What I can tell you is, we‘re trying to get the changes that are going to make this bill work for the typical American. This cake is not yet baked, Keith. There is a long way to go. We‘ve got to change the McCarran-Ferguson Law to increase competition. We‘ve got to make sure that all Americans, not just a few, have the public option.

I want to make sure that consumers can deliver an ultimatum to their insurance company. The way America works is when you have choice. That‘s what happens in every other area of our economy. I‘m going to make sure it happens in health insurance, too.

OLBERMANN: Senator Ron Wyden of Oregon--great thanks for your time tonight.

WYDEN: Thank you.

OLBERMANN: And good luck with the baking.

WYDEN: Thank you.

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