CNN "Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Steven Cohen

Interview

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BERMAN: Joining me now is Democratic Congressman Steve Cohen who sits on the Judiciary Committee.

Congressman Cohen, thanks so much for being with us.

Your chairman, Jerry Nadler, described today as, quote, a sad and solemn day. I wonder how you would describe it.

REP. STEVE COHEN (D-TN): Well, it is sad in terms that we have a

president who has committed offenses against the Constitution. The Constitution is our -- that's our guide. That's what we live by. That's our law.

It's 200 and something years old, and the Founding Fathers did a great job, and we're supposed to -- we take an oath to obey it, and we had a president who betrayed his oath and risked our national security and tried to corrupt our election process. And that's a sad day when a president does that and doesn't understand it, and it's even a sadder day when all of the Republicans went along with him and refused to see what was right before their faces that he did it.

BERMAN: Let me ask more about that because it does appear near certain that the articles of impeachment will pass the full House, but they'll pass the full House without any Republican votes there either. And I do wonder because there are a couple dozen, maybe more Republicans who aren't running for re-election. These are people who don't have to satisfy their base.

So what does it tell you that these retiring members, who don't necessarily have anything to gain, are going to vote against impeachment?

COHEN: Well, for one thing they have to live within the caucus for the rest of the time they're there. You know, Justin Amash came out against the president and said that he was for impeachment. They put him out of the caucus. They stripped him of his committees, and they put him out of the caucus.

So these people have got another year in the Republican House Caucus, and they probably don't want to get put out, stripped of their committees, and scorned. And then when they leave their job, some of them might have ambitions to get an appointment from this president, assuming he gets a second term. I don't think he will, but they probably think he might, and certainly that's a better ticket for them than a Democrat winning, and they don't want to be on the outs then.

But, you know, that's just two kind of craven political reasons why they may be there.

[20:10:05]

And then, you know, they just may -- I've never been in a Republican Caucus. They may just take Kool-Aid communion every day.

BERMAN: So Mitch McConnell, who is the Senate majority leader, spoke last night about the Senate trial. Listen to what he said.

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SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): Everything I do during this, I'm coordinating with White House counsel. We'll be working through this process, hopefully in a fairly short period of time, in total coordination with the White House counsel's office and the people who are representing the president. I'm 'm going to coordinate with the president's lawyers, so there won't be any difference between us on how to do this. I'm going to take my cues from the president's lawyers.

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BERMAN: So some Democrats are raising red flags about this, saying that basically, you're having the jury coordinate with defense lawyers there. But Tom Daschle, who was the Senate Democratic leader, the minority leader during the Clinton impeachment trial, told CNN today that during the Clinton impeachment saga, his staff was in constant coordination with the White House.

So how is this any different?

COHEN: Well, I'm not sure exactly what it was, but I can guarantee Mitch McConnell stole a Supreme Court justice that Barack Obama should have had, Merrick Garland, from him, and who stole a whole bunch of district court judges and mine. I was -- my district court nominee, Ed Stanton Jr. -- who was Ed Stanton III, who's an outstanding, highly rated nominee, approve by the bar, a year out, he didn't approve a district court judge in Memphis and a bunch of people after him.

So, Mitch McConnell will do whatever he can do to manipulate the process to his advantage. And I would -- I would suspect that what he does will be different than what Daschle does, and they'll try to stack the deck.

And the whole idea of not calling witnesses, which I've heard is a possibility, having the case put on for a week and having a case put on by the other side for a week and then calling the question, getting the vote, and getting out is not right. They should have a trial. There should be witnesses. There should be the opportunity to see what you just told the people there of Trump getting on the White House lawn and going, I want Ukraine to investigate. They should investigate Joe Biden. China should investigate Hunter Biden or Joe Biden.

They should have those videos played in the Senate for the senators and for the public as well to remind them of what went on. Mulvaney, this is the way it is, get used to. They need to have all of that, and they should have more. They should have Fiona Hill, Dr. Hill, Ambassador Taylor, Ambassador Yovanovitch, Lieutenant Colonel Vindman, have some of their testimony.

They were shocked. They are independent Foreign Service officials. They are American patriots. They had no political thing in this at all. They risked their careers to testify and to immediately say this was wrong.

BERMAN: Congressman Steve Cohen, thanks for joining us tonight. We always appreciate your time, sir.

COHEN: You're welcome. I saw you this morning. Nice to see you tonight.

BERMAN: We're working a long day but it's worth it. Appreciate it. Coming up, what will be the contours of President Trump's defense in

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