CNN "CNN Newsroom" - Transcript: "Interview with Rep. Jason Crow"

Interview

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POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: For being here. We'll get to all of that in just a moment.

I do want to begin, though, with what is supposed to happen in one minute where you are on Capitol Hill. Charles Kupperman, the ex-deputy former national security adviser to John Bolton is supposed to show up for a scheduled testimony in the impeachment inquiry. He's considered a key witness. He was on that July phone call between President Trump and the leader of Ukraine. His attorney says he's not going to come. They want a judge to decide if he should.

What's your reaction?

REP. JASON CROW (D-CO): Well, we need a ruling on that lawsuit filed by Mr. Kupperman's attorney. The president and his lawyers have, you know, said that due to constitutional immunities that Mr. Kupperman can't testify. Clearly, the intelligence community has the -- or committee has the authority to request that testimony. We need that testimony to gets to the bottom of what happened in Ukraine.

HARLOW: Right.

CROW: So we hope to get a ruling very quickly here so that we can get Mr. Kupperman's testimony.

HARLOW: OK.

So, on this beat, on the inquiry, for a moment before we move on, you said on NPR last month that this whole process, in your words, must be open and transparent. I wonder if you think at all that your Republican colleagues in the House have a legitimate gripe with this all taking place behind closed doors at this point? And, yes, transcripts will be released. Adam Schiff has assured everyone of that. But, for example, they bring up in the Clinton impeachment that his attorneys were allowed in the room during depositions. Do they have a legitimate gripe? I mean you've said open and transparent is important.

CROW: Yes, what's different now is that in past inquiries, a special prosecutor appointed by the attorney general conducted, you know, classified and, you know, behind closed doors investigations. And the reason you do that is to protect the innocent, right? When you're calling witnesses, you don't want innocent people to be smeared. It's to get information to make sure that there isn't witness tampering, that witnesses are not comparing notes.

Unfortunately, there was a criminal referral in this case. The attorney general declined to do anything to follow up on it. So that puts now the House in the position of doing that investigation. We have to get that done. So we have to make sure we're doing that initial stage in a proper way and then that will transition to open hearings and the transcripts will be made available for all the stuff that's happening now.

And, by the way, I think it's really important to know that Republicans are involved in this process. Republican lawyers are involved in the process.

HARLOW: Yes, 48 of them.

CROW: Absolutely.

HARLOW: Sure. I -- that is --

CROW: I mean they're in the room.

HARLOW: That is what -- noted, Congressman.

CROW: Yes.

HARLOW: OK, so moving on.

You serve on the Armed Services Committee. You're a member of the Syria caucus. You just returned from a congressional visit to the region. You served, as I said, as an Army Ranger in Afghanistan.

Lindsey Graham said overnight, Trump's worst critics should say, well done, Mr. President, on the death of Baghdadi. Do you agree?

CROW: Well, this was undeniably a victory for America. I mean the special operations forces, the pilots that were involved. I've been involved in many of these types of raids before. They're very dangerous. They're very complicated. I know what went into the planning of this. This was about a four-month process. These are very difficult things to execute and to pull off. So, you know, the special operations forces, the commandos, the pilots, the intelligence officials involved did a remarkable job. And it's a great day for America. There's no doubt about that.

HARLOW: We just heard the president a few moments ago criticizing Adam Schiff, your fellow Democrat in Congress, calling him a leaker, you know, as part of the rationale for not alerting him, Nancy Pelosi, the gang of eight, et cetera, before this raid. But some Republicans in Congress, we're told, Russia was told, not the details, but Russia was told.

What is your response to that? CROW: Well, I've been concerned for a long time about the president's

politicizing of the military. So, you know, he doesn't have an obligation to inform Congress in advance of a mission like this. But the fact that he did inform some members of Congress of his party and not others is very concerning.

And, you know, there are reasons to inform Russia. I mean the eight helicopters that went in to northern Syria to conduct this mission actually were operating in air space controlled by Russian and Syrian air force, you know, personnel. So there had to be some deconfliction I would imagine to make that happen and to ensure the safety.

HARLOW: Yes.

CROW: So I understand that. But I am concerned about the politicizing of our military. There's no doubt about it.

HARLOW: You wrote this, quote, the successful mission shows once again how important it is that we partner with our allies around the world. We are stronger with friends.

I am assuming that you were talking especially about the Kurds here. So correct me if I'm wrong, but if not, listen to what Defense Secretary Mark Esper had to say to Jake on that front just yesterday.

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JAKE TAPPER, HOST, "STATE OF THE UNION": The administration has been taking a lot of heat for the handling of the U.S./Kurdish allies in northern Syria. Did the Kurds play a role in this operation?

MARK ESPER, DEFENSE SECRETARY: I'm not going to discuss who all participated, but we had some help from outside partners.

TAPPER: But the U.S. allies, the main U.S. allies in that region are the Kurds.

ESPER: That's right. I'm just not going to get into details right now.

TAPPER: OK. The general of the Kurdish forces, the U.S. ally Kurdish forces, say that they did play a role. Is that --

[09:35:01]

ESPER: Well, the SDF have been good partners for the last few years. They were instrumental to us helping defeat, destroy the physical caliphate of ISIS. And, again, we remain in contact with them on the ground and they've been helpful in a variety of ways.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: It seemed to me, congressman, like Jake had to sort of draw that out of the defense secretary and we -- you know, we heard the president yesterday say, quote, Russia treated us great.

I just wonder if you think, does it sound like to you the administration is not giving our Kurdish allies enough credit?

CROW: Well, the president, over the last three weeks, has been consistently downplaying the role of our Kurdish forces. You know, what is very clear to me is that this mission would not have happened had it not been for Iraqi intelligence, for SDF forces on the ground, for our partners on the ground, human intelligence, you know, basically spies and informants on the ground in northern Syria, from the Kurdish forces and others, it's my understanding, provided the intelligence that located al-Baghdadi.

That's why partners are important. You know, we cannot go into areas of the world, like the Middle East and Syria and Afghanistan and other places and get this information on our own. I know. I've tried. It's very hard. We don't have the networks on the ground. People don't trust us walking into, you know, villages, in the mountains. But they can do it. The local forces can do it.

So that's why it's really important and that's why the last three weeks I've been a critic of the president's move because we have left those folks behind. We've turned our back on them and we're less safe.

HARLOW: Congressman Jason Crow, thank you for being here and, of course, thank you for your service to this country.

CROW: Thanks, Poppy.

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