CNN "The Situation Room" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Jim Himes

Interview

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BLITZER: Congress going into recess for a few days as well around Memorial Day weekend. Thanks very much, Phil Mattingly up on Capitol Hill.

Joining us now, Democratic Congressman Jim Himes of Connecticut, he's a member of the Intelligence Committee. Congressman thanks so much for joining us. And as you heard, the president says his decision to give the attorney general declassification power is all about transparency. That's what the president says. But the chairman of your committee, Adam Schiff, says this is an effort in his word to weaponize intelligence. What are your concerns?

REP. JIM HIMES (D), CALIFORNIA: Yes, of course it is. My concerns, quite frankly, Wolf, are the attorney general, Bill Barr. Look, I've actually seen all of the intelligence and work that led to the initiation of this investigation. And I know if that information were to get out there, it would completely contradict the president's story that there was some kind of coup attempt here.

Look -- and that's not just me talking. The inspector general of the Department of Justice did an investigation and checked this out and the conclusion was that Peter Strzok and all of the people that the president likes talking about constantly, that there was no evidence that political bias entered into the way they did their work.

I would also urge people, and Wolf, this is important. I would urge people to step back, because we're going to get into FISA affidavits and the way investigations are originated, step back here a second and remember what happened and what is not in dispute.

Here's what happened. Jim Comey at the time, the director of the FBI and now, of course, the enemy of the president, Jim Comey twice, before the presidential election of November 2016, announced an investigation into one candidate, to Hillary Clinton, and did not announce an investigation that was ongoing into another candidate, Donald Trump.

So there is an argument to be made that the FBI and in particular Jim Comey handed this election to Donald Trump. It was that close. And yet, here we are two years later plus and the president believes this mad cap theory that there was something going on in the FBI that was designed to stop him from becoming president. And again, who knows. Someday mathematicians will figure this out. But the historical facts show that the FBI, if anything, was a dramatic assist in Donald Trump becoming president.

Now, we'll have this conversation about how that investigation started. What worries me just to answer your question is that Bill Barr has shown himself from moment one to not be a fair arbiter here, when he called surveillance spying, when he came out with a pre-spin on Bob Mueller's report that Bob Mueller himself rejected, we know that he is not treating this situation fairly. He is going to pick and choose whatever he can find that buttresses the president's bizarre, insane, and completely wrong argument, but which is in his favor.

[17:15:14] BLITZER: So what's the worst-case scenario? What do you fear could happen with the declassification of these documents, if they're all made public?

HIMES: Well, look, it's a limited thing. It's not like everything comes apart. But what could happen is that, let's just imagine that there were wiretaps or signals intelligence or other intercepts. If he declassifies something and this is Bill Barr, he will declassify what he needs to declassify in the service of the president.

It is possible that our foes will learn a little bit about our capabilities. Even larger, though, Wolf, and this I feel very strongly about this, all over the world right now, CIA case officers are talking to people in very dangerous places it might be Kabul, it might be Moscow, who knows where it is, and they are saying, trust us, trust us. If you work for us, if you help us, there is no risk that you will ever be exposed.

The president of the United States, in the service of a complete fantasy, has basically announced to the world that for political reasons, we may blow sources and methods. And that is going to have a profoundly damaging effect on our ability to learn the secrets we need to learn to keep Americans safe.

BLITZER: You make an important point. When you heard the president earlier today say he hopes the attorney general looks at the United Kingdom, Australia, and Ukraine. The UK and Australia obviously among the closest allies the United States has, an enormous amount of intelligence cooperation that goes on with them. What was your reaction?

HIMES: Well, it sort of doesn't matter what the president says, because the president could not be more wrong. Not a single allegation that the president has made has been sustained in this area. Again, Department of Justice inspector general report says that the FBI was not motivated by politics.

You know the conclusions of the famous Devin Nunes report in the Intelligence Community, which said that the Russians were not trying to help Donald Trump, refuted by the Mueller report. So facts are not in any way, shape, or form this president's friend, but I do worry about the fact that now somebody who has clearly identified themselves as on the president's team, that's Bill Barr, the attorney general, will selectively pick and choose things that make the president look good and it will be done at the expense of our ability to gather secrets around the world that are important to keeping Americans safe.

BLITZER: Because some sources have said to me, today in fact, they suggested, this is going to make it more difficult for the U.S. to gather intelligence, shared intelligence with among the closest U.S. allies. They might all of a sudden become more reluctant to share very sensitive information if they find that that information is made public and could undermine their respective sources and methods. I assume you've heard that as well?

HIMES: Well that's exactly right. As you probably know, Wolf, we do an immense amount of intelligence sharing with our allies. They're known as the five I's, Great Britain, other countries that - Australia that we just plain trust. And you know, they've already been pretty badly beaten up, because let's talk very briefly about some other episodes in which American secrets were blown. The Snowden Case. The Snowden case, Snowden goes out there and sort of discloses all sorts of sources and methods. Two things happen.

The bad guys changed their ways of operating. So Edward Snowden's releases changed very bad people's way of operating, in ways that make it hard for us to know what they're doing. And secondarily, of course, our allies who share information now say you really can't trust the United States. Now, look, Edward Snowden, you know sadly it's impossible to fully prevent that.

But a president saying, for political purposes, to further my fantasy. And let's face it, nobody outside to have the White House and Donald Trump's most fervent supporters believes that there was some coup plotted, some political attack on the president's presidency. What the UK and Australia and New Zealand see is because the president, in order to forward a political fantasy may blow our sources and methods, put our people at risk. This is a very dangerous thing for the United States.

BLITZER: The president obviously strongly disagrees with you. He says there was an attempted coup and he says those coup plotters, in his words, committed treason. Congressman Jim Himes thanks so much for joining us.

HIMES: Thank you, Wolf.

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