MSNBC "Hardball" - Transcript: Interview with Sen. Chris Coons

Interview

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MATTHEWS: I don`t know. I`m getting very skeptical about whether --  rather, wondering how far the president and his people will go.

The president has apparently squirreled away the notes of all his meetings  with Putin. He doesn`t want even his own officials in his administration  to know what he talked about.

I wonder, are you worried about William Barr and whether he will in fact  deliver the Robert Mueller report to the public and to the Congress?

SEN. CHRIS COONS (D), DELAWARE: I am, Chris.

I`m looking forward to tomorrow`s confirmation hearing. I had a chance to  meet with William Barr last week and to ask him a number of the questions  I`m going to repeat tomorrow on the record in a confirmation hearing.

I have an editorial that`s just gone up in "The Washington Post" that  repeats the context and why this isn`t a normal time. I`m encouraged that  President Trump has nominated someone who previously served as attorney  general and who has got a lot of experience in the Department of Justice.

But when William Barr served as attorney general more than 25 years ago, we  didn`t have a president who was under investigation and whose personal  attorney and campaign manager and national security adviser had either pled  guilty to or been convicted of a variety of crimes involving lying to the  government.

So I`m going to be pressing William Barr tomorrow to allow the Mueller  investigation to go to its logical conclusion, to release the report to the  Congress and the public, to submit to the ethics officials in the  Department of Justice to see whether he should recuse himself, given that  19-page tryout memo you just referenced, and to get some clarity from him  about whether he would defend and follow the Special Counsel Integrity and  Independence Act that Senator Lindsey Graham and Thom Tillis has  reintroduced, along with Senator Booker and myself.

MATTHEWS: Are you going to try to get from him the commitment that Elliot  Richardson gave to Ted Kennedy, that he would resign…

COONS: Yes.

MATTHEWS: … if forced to fire -- forced to fire Mueller?

COONS: Yes.

MATTHEWS: Let me ask you about the weekend news.

COONS: Yes, that`s important precedent to remind folks about, the Saturday  Night Massacre back during the Watergate investigation, where President  Nixon ordered Elliot Richardson to fire the special prosecutor.
He refused, and he resigned instead in protest. That followed a  confirmation hearing where Elliot Richardson was asked exactly that question. If pressed to interfere or intervene with the investigation or to fire the special prosecutor, will you resign in protest?

Elliot Richardson said yes, and he followed that commitment. That`s  exactly the sort of exchange I expect…

MATTHEWS: Yes.

COONS: … that we will be having tomorrow on the Judiciary Committee with  William Barr.

MATTHEWS: And, by the way, in reference to that, Nixon had the honor and  the respect for institutions to honor that deal. I`m not sure Trump will.

COONS: That`s right.

MATTHEWS: But let me ask you about this weekend`s news.

"The New York Times" reported over the weekend that the FBI suspected that  the president wasn`t just covering up, he wasn`t just obstructing justice  to protect himself, but in furtherance of a Soviet or Russian -- a Russian  conspiracy.

In other words, he was acting to protect them from exposure for what they  did in the 2016 election. That`s astounding.

COONS: It is astounding.

MATTHEWS: What do you make of that charge, that he was, in fact, an agent?

COONS: Well, Chris, that`s exactly why I think we need to have Robert  Mueller`s investigation proceed to its logical conclusion, and then have  those results shared with Congress and the public.

I don`t know whether those allegations are well-founded or whether they  aren`t. There certainly has been some troubling, disturbing, unprecedented  actions by our president, in refusing to accept the conclusions of the  intelligence community, of resisting efforts by senators, both Republican  and Democrat, to pass sanctions against Russia after the 2016 elections,  conducting himself in an unusual way in that Helsinki summit with President  Putin.

There are certainly concerning signs. But I don`t have concrete evidence  of this. And that`s exactly why a well-respected Republican senior law  enforcement leader like Robert Mueller has been empowered to conduct this  special investigation and needs to be allowed to do it and reach its  natural conclusion.

MATTHEWS: You know, I`m thinking about the difference between the modern- day Democratic Party, which has cleaned up its act from the dirty old days  of the big city machines.

The Democratic Party is almost like a suburban party in many ways now. The  Republican Party picked up on all the bad behaviors of the big Democratic  machines of 50, 60 years ago. Have you noticed?

Like, you guys are going to actually let William Barr have a fair hearing.  You`re actually talking to him. You may well confirm him in a bipartisan  way. You might do that.

Mitch McConnell, operating in the dirty old ways of the old machines, he  wouldn`t even give Merrick Garland a chance, wouldn`t talk to him, for a  member of the Supreme Court.

COONS: That`s right.

MATTHEWS: You guys are operating like gentlemen, to use an old term. Do  you notice?

COONS: I have noticed.

MATTHEWS: You`re actually going to consider this guy.

And explain. Why are you guys being decent, when the Republicans are  indecent? Just a thought.

COONS: Well, I will also say, Chris, one of the places that Mitch  McConnell is absent is in any conversation about how to end the shutdown.

We`re in day 24 of a government shutdown. And if President Trump will  reopen the government, I think we could make progress on border security.  But I will remind you, the majority leader is nowhere to be found in these  negotiations, and I think he bears some real responsibility in helping move  forward a resolution to this impasse.

I`m hearing from folks up and down my home state of Delaware, whether  they`re federal law enforcement officers who are serving without pay, who I  called and asked about morale and operational effectiveness, to farmers and  folks concerned about food safety, about where the Department of  Agriculture or the Food and Drug Administration is in terms of protecting  our public health or supporting our agriculture community.

MATTHEWS: Yes.

COONS: We have got a lot of impacts from the shutdown, and I think Mitch  McConnell should step forward and take his responsible role and help  negotiate a resolution and get President Trump to reopen the government.

MATTHEWS: Thanks so much, Chris Coons, who represents a state that has a  lot of agriculture in the south and big city thinking in the north.

Anyway, thank you, sir, from Delaware.

COONS: Thank you, Chris.

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