CNN "Erin Burnett Outfront" - Transcript: Interview with Bernie Sanders (I) Vermont
Interview
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BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much. In a White House that leaks like a sieve, the best thing to do is not tell around you who you picked. And then, it can't leak.
[19:05:00] OUTFRONT now, Independent Senator Bernie Sanders. Senator Sanders, I appreciate your time. But we understand the President made his choice. When you talk about just the logistics of getting someone there and informing them, making it at 3:00 Eastern is pretty darn late for a 9:00 p.m. announcement that's what we understand.
Senator, Is there anyone this President could realistically pick that would be acceptable to you?
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: Well, there are many people he could realistically pick, people who respected the rights of workers, people who respected women's rights, people who are concerned about the environment and climate change, people who believed in justice. If President Trump were to nominate somebody who held those beliefs, of course, I could support that person.
Do I realistically think that that is going to be the nominee? No, I don't. As you know, Trump has indicated that he is working off a list of 25 right-wing legal people. And that during the campaign he said, pretty publicly, that his nominee would be somebody to overturn Roe versus Wade. If that's one of his nominees, no, I certainly will not support him or her.
BURNETT: All right. So, on the list of 25 that you're not amenable to, one of the judges that we understand, I don't know if you just heard our Jeff Zeleny, but he's saying it could obviously be anyone on that list of 25. But we believe at this point, he had whittled it down possibly to Judge Thomas Hardiman and Judge Brett Kavanaugh.
I want to ask you about Thomas Hardiman. Obviously, he's on the Third Circuit Court of Appeals right now. And part of the reason he's there is because of you, you voted to confirm him as a Circuit court judge. So --
SANDERS: Well, wait a minute. Let's -- who else voted for him on that one? In fact, everybody voted for him, right?
BURNETT: Right. Well, Democrats did.
SANDERS: Yes, that was unanimous.
BURNETT: My point is, you're saying -- you're now putting him as a conservative you couldn't support. But obviously a decade ago you didn't feel the same way.
SANDERS: Well, yes, but there is a difference between voting for somebody in a lower court and voting for somebody in the highest court of the land. There is a fundamental difference. And if he is the nominee --
BURNETT: Which is what? I mean, that principles would matter in either case, right?
SANDERS: Well, the principle is that the Supreme Court makes the law of the land, and determines what happens in our country in virtually every area. So, yes, there is a fundamental difference.
Look, what we are talking about here is in a moment in American history where we have right-wing extremists controlling the House, the Senate and the White House. If we appoint another right-wing extremist to the Supreme Court, I have very serious concerns about justice in this country and what will happen to the men, women and children and the future of our nation. So --
BURNETT: Just to be clear, would Thomas Hardiman be a right-wing extremist now as you define it?
SANDERS: Yes, if he is on a list of the 25 that were presented to the President, yes, he would be somebody that I would feel impossible to support.
BURNETT: Your colleague, the Democratic Senator Bob Casey from Pennsylvania, he said he would oppose anybody on the list, which I believe is similar to what you're saying to me now, right?
SANDERS: Yes, yes.
BURNETT: OK. The White House Deputy Press Secretary Raj Shah responded, and his response was unfortunate though not surprising even before his or her qualifications can be evaluated, Senator Casey is refusing to consider the President's SCOTUS nominee. Doesn't he have a point? I mean, that it would be --
SANDERS: Not really, it depends. I think what Bob said is that, if it were part of that list of 25. And that list of 25 is not just an arbitrary list. These are people who have been assembled by right- wing jurists and they have views on Roe versus Wade, they have views on workers' rights, they have views on the environment which in many cases are well known. So this is not just any old person. I would not say that, you know, any person should be summarily rejected. But if they're a member of that list, they should look. This is --
BURNETT: Do you regret then voting for Thomas Hardiman on that lower court? Because I know you're saying it's different, but the reality is he wouldn't be up for this if he hadn't gotten that.
SANDERS: Look I voted -- look, when you vote for lower court judges, sometimes we get blue slips and there's a process that goes by. I think that vote was 95 to nothing, is that correct?
BURNETT: Yes.
SANDERS: 95-nothing. And there are a number of votes like that. But let's be clear, voting for a Supreme Court justice is very different than voting for anybody in a lower court.
Look, what we're talking about is a right-wing agenda which not only wants to end Roe versus Wade, despite the fact that 70 percent of the American people support the maintenance of Roe versus Wade. Not only wants to overturn decisions regarding gay marriage and gay rights despite strong support from the American people.
[19:10:00] The right-wing agenda goes so far as to really side time and time again with large corporations who are attacking workers' rights. Even the concept of the minimum wage, which now is a starvation wage of $7.25 an hour. There are people, right-wing people saying, no, no, that's unconstitutional.
We're talking about healthcare. We're talking about --
BURNETT: OK.
SANDERS: -- issues of women's health in general.
BURNETT: Senator.
SANDERS: Yes?
BURNETT: I want to ask you before we go, but while I have your time about the deadline tomorrow which you know, of course, is the government's deadline to reunite children under 5 who were separated at the border from their parents. Half of the children are going to be reunited by that deadline.
And the Trump administration isn't sure about the rest. The federal judge though who set this deadline for reunification said he's, quote, "very encouraged thus far." Again, I've said half of those children will be reunited by the deadline, half will not. Are you encouraged?
SANDERS: Am I encouraged by a President who ripped children out of the arms of their mother? In a situation in which the authorities did not even know where these kids were, am I encouraged? No, I am outraged by what Trump and his administration have done. Obviously, I would hope and expect that every person in this country, every person in the world believes and expects that these children should be united with their parents. We will see what happens. But I have -- if you want to know what I've been impressed by, it's the incompetence of the Trump administration, even the simplest things in this area.
BURNETT: ICE has become a lightning rod in this. The Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell was followed out of a restaurant this weekend. Protesters were yelling personal insults at him, chanting "abolish ICE" and vote him out. I want to play a clip for you, Senator Sanders.
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BURNETT: Senator, among the protesters were members of a local chapter of the Democrat Socialists of America. Do you think their behavior was acceptable?
SANDERS: Look, getting back to this very issue of immigration, there are people all over this country that are outraged that little kids have been separated from their parents, which no doubt will cause, I guess, permanent psychological damage when you separate a kid from his or her parents. So people are outraged and I understand that.
I happen to believe that if we want to deal with real immigration reform, if we want to deal with real criminal justice reform, if we want to deal with the environment, the area that we should be focussing on energy on is ending Republican control over the House and over the Senate.
And I am going to do everything I can and millions of people are going to do everything they can, putting together a grassroots movement which demands that we have a government that represents all of us and not just wealthy campaign contributors. So I think our focus of energy should be on bringing change to the House and the Senate and supporting a progressive agenda.
BURNETT: Senator Sanders, thank you for your time tonight.
SANDERS: Thank you.
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